HighIntensity.net View Mike Mentzer Bodybuilding Topic

Hi,

1st things 1st, I′d like to say hello to all you peeps in HIT land..

I′ve just stumbled accross Mikes "HIT the MM Way" Book and it has opened my eyes. Like many of you (i′ve been reading the forums form a few days now) I was a volume guy who has had very slow progres.. I have a couple questions I hope you can answer.

I′ma 6ft 1inch dude and weigh 182 lbs… BF of about 16%..

Having read Mikes book cover to cover i have started on the "ideal routine" and complted my chest & back routine as of yesterday morning.. however, the more I read the forums, the more people I see using the consolodation routine.. should i have not bothered with the Ideal routine and transferred straight to consolodation as I am not a beginner, more of an enthusiastic intermediate..

Secondly, is 150-250g′s protein a day enough to build new muscle… I′m eating a diet of around 1900-2100 calories as this is my maintenence calorific requirement..

Nearly done…

..I play football on a wednesday night for 45-60 minutes, how much is that going to affect my gains as MM said no to cardio didn′t he?

And finally, I know I pushed myself to my physical limit yesterday, however i′m not remotely sore today, just a bit tired..did I do something wrong or am I being stupid and linking following day soreness with progress when it possibly has no relation.. lol.

Anyway, I hope I havent wasted anyone′s time and as I learn more about HIT and have my own experiences i′ll look forward to giving something back to the board, including full publication of my progress logs..

Cheers.

Jamie (pedro mcdodge)

Hey mate, I′m a sort of novice going intermediate (pics on www.photobucket.com/mrcatalyst) so I give you my words from that perspective.. and just to say hi and say all the best on your training and football.

Whether you train Ideal or Consoliated, if you follow either program well then I expect you will make good gains. You may enjoy the Ideal routine more because it involves more exercises (personal preference). I′d suggest the consolidated routine as I think the exercises involved and structure of program might be more effective in getting your muscles worked in the shortest time possible. This is something I′m about to experiment in so… I′ll let you know! I can′t speak from a great deal of personal practice (in regards to strictly following the Ideal routine) or from other people′s training experience.. so my apologies for not offering much on your first question.

I′m not much of a pro-eat loads of protein guy so I think staying to a 200g maximum daily intake would be fine. Still though, I would eat the protein in doses throughout the day to help keep you in an anbolic state as opposed to taking mega doses at one particular time. Also, I think you′d be better off eating 2-300 calories above maintenance rather then being too concerned with daily grams of protein. Monitor your weight and observe your body for changes – bigger pinch here or more defintion etc. Excuse my directness but if you visit the toilet multiple times or experience ′changes′ then you could literally be ′wasting′ away your money and excess protein intake. Your body will speak to you so listen 🙂

Try to fit your football in the middle of your off-days. So this way your not making the dash for a long through ball or sprinting back to close down the opposition too soon post and pre training day! Keep yourself low gi carb fuelled pre match and replenish your energy at half time and post match to ensure your body doesn′t resort to feeding on itself for fuel. Otherwise, enjoy your sport!

Don′t worry about soreness. From my experiece I got soreness from either a new exercise or too many sets (overtraining, for example drop-set Squats from 100kg to body weight failure with no rest between sets as my mate was un-loading 10kg each set… STUPID with a capital FOOL!).
A better sign of your training performance is a bit of mental fatigue the hour post-training and that heavy tired feeling that sinks through your body when you lie down a couple hours later! I′ve had training where I have been sore for a long time and also in discomfort (namely poor form and volume training).. don′t be at all discouraged if you don′t get the pain factor the next day.. let your results and mirror reflection relate to the effectiveness of your hard work. My recent 3 full body workout regime has been intense and gruelling BUT it′s not made me feel like a wreck the next day. Train with form and with intensity and your on your way mate.

All the best mate, hope your are well and enjoy your new training.

Thanks for the detailed feedback matey,

I do eat about 8-10 very small "meals" a day..I say "meals" because it could be a handfull of nuts, or 12 wafer slices of chicken breast etc… Only reals meals are bowl porridge for breaky and tuna sandwich on wholemeal and some natural yoghurt for lunch..

I only play football for fun with 9 of my mates once a week, so it′s nothing too grueling, we stop after 40 minutes without fail, EVERY WEEK because my mate Belly always has to throw up or sit down for a bit due to too many bevs the night before..and when we restart it′s a fairly laboured pace…it would make Shola Ameobi look like C. Ronaldo..

I was mentally nackered after the training and I have never slept so well in my life so I trust I did everything well at the gym.. it′s tricky putting your trust in something radical like HIT when you′ve been programmed to think "More is More" in relation to weights..

Thanks again matey, i′ll pop up my progress charts after 4 weeks on Ideal Routine and then switch to Combined for 8 weeks and post my progress after that… fingers crossed.

pedro,

Building muscle is about eating a little more total calories than weight maintenance level, not about eating your bodyweight in grams of protein. To illustrate this, you can eat 300 grams of protein, but if your total calories are less than weight maintenance level, you′re not going to build muscle. You can eat 100 grams of protein, and if your total calories are a little more than weight maintenance level, you′ll build muscle. Eating two-thirds of your lean bodyweight in grams of protein per day is more than enough protein to build muscle if you′re eating enough carbs.

One day of cardio shouldn′t really affect your gains, just make sure you account for the calorie expenditure by eating a little more that day.

Soreness is an indication that you did something your body wasn′t used to. Track progress with your workout log, not with soreness.

I went from volume training to the ideal routine too, because i like doing more exercises. I will eventually get to the consolidation routine soon, but I have made decent gains doing the Ideal so I′m waiting for them to slow down first.

For me cardio gets in the way of building muscle so i am not doing it right now. I′m eating probably 200-600 extra calories a day and have put on barely any body fat.

mrcatalyst is right 200-300 calories above maintnence is all you really need, but i would suggest eat a little more if you have a hard day of football and get a lot of sleep. As for protein, .08 to 1 gram per pound of body weight is all you need. Most people eat way too much, when i was volume training i did have to eat more, but now that i switched to HIT i don′t have to eat as much. However that does not mean the training is easier, it is harder going to absolute muscular failure, have you really tried that yet on the big compound movements? Sometimes my brain will tell me i cant go on, but ill push myself and get out another 1-3 reps until i literally can′t lift anymore. Have you ever barely been able to walk after just one set of leg presses?

It is suggested that an athlete go to the consolidation routine because it would probably yield better results. If your only doing football once a week, which it looks like you said, then the Ideal routine should be fine. In the end its in your hands to determine which routine is better for you.

Stick with a routine for at least three months before determining weather it is beneficial or not. A common problem with people is they expect significant results immediately and although that might happen to some, most people progress little by little. I progress slowly in most exercises and patients is key. The exercises i have had the best gains in are, Dead lifts, Squats and Leg press that seems to be common though with almost everyone.

Have you looked into any advanced techniques yet? Like rest-pause, static holds and negatives. You can incorporate those into your workouts every now and then, but be careful, they can lead to over training very quickly.

You might want to get some more books too, like, "The Wisdom Of Mike Mentzer", or, "Heavy Duty 2 Mind and Body". Also "Mike Mentzer′s Heavy Duty Nutrition", can be found on the internet. Check out his Under ground seminar on you tube when you have time. I′m sure other people in here have good advice also on some other great books.

Good luck.